What's So Bad About Calling the President a Liar?

Republican Joe Wilson heckles Obama

Everyone seems to agree that it was bad for South Carolina Republican Joe Wilson to yell "You lie!" at the president last night during the health care speech. Gail Collins calls it "not a good plan," New York Democrat Joseph Crowley called it "outrageous," and Rahm Emanuel said: "No president has ever been treated like that. Ever." That's when I started to get suspicious. Rahm Emanuael? The man known to fit three "fucks" in a sentence, outraged by "lie"? The president himself said his opponents "lie" not seconds before, and it's much more unusual for a president to use that word than for some back-bench congressman. Outside of that chamber the health care debate has been anything but civil, so why pretend otherwise?

Wilson has of course already apologized, saying, "my emotions got the better of me." The president wasn't available to take the call so he had to apologize to Emanuel instead, which must have hurt. My only disappointment is that this was a spontaneous outburst instead of a genuine, deliberate heckle. One of the great pleasures of seeing Obama give an official speech is that you can imagine you're in London, watching the British parliament, where spirited and sometimes nasty debate might takes place instead of the tedious "civility" that governs these phony American sessions. When I heard that outburst last night I thought, finally, we've arrived.

Photograph by Chip Somodevilla/Getty Images.

Tags: Barack Obama, health care, joe wilson, obama speech about health care

VIEW THIS CONVERSATION

Hanna Rosin Double X co- editor, reporter, prefer my friends live.

Comments

The worst thing

By: misslkodell | Fri, 09/11/2009 - 09:00

Joe Wilson had to be told to apologize to the WH by his party leadership! And to everyone who says its just like Dems booing Bush, Obama was being booed too before the comment was said. Booing is perfectly acceptable in the polarized political landscape we are in, but still you have to respect the person who was elected by a majority of the population, calling out a false statement just because you disagree with a statement is wrong. Thankfully his outburst will probably cost him his re-election. His constituents are talking with massive funding to his opponent.

House Republican Rules

By: Madeline | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 22:54

What's so bad about calling the president a liar? Well, it's against the Republican's published "Rules": http://rules-republicans.house.gov/Educational/Read.aspx?ID=5

Categories of Unparliamentary Speech
*Defaming or degrading the House
*Criticism of the Speaker’s personal conduct
*Impugning the motives of another Member
*Charging falsehood or deception
*Claiming lack of intelligence or knowledge
*References to race, creed, or prejudice
*Charges related to loyalty or patriotism

"Charging falsehood or deception" is unparliamentary speech. Booing or dropping the f-bomb are not.

Incidentally, I found this in approximately 10 seconds by googling, and no one's paying me to publish my thoughts on this topic...

@MrJM

By: P Starling | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 18:48

I would love to know how many times Rahm Emanuel said "Fuck" during his conversation with Wilson last night. Ouch.

Seriously?

By: MrJM | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 14:39

You really can't see the difference between Rahm Emanuel using the word "fuck" in conversation and calling the President of the United States a liar during an address to a joint session of Congress?

Of course you can, because you are not a fool.

So, please stop pretending to be a fool.

-- MrJM

Stop irresponsible political posturing

By: P Starling | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 18:46

The CEO of a very large corporation is making a presentation to a fractious corporate board about a new, potentially lucrative, and risky business model. A substantial percentage of the board dislikes the idea. One of the board members stands up, yells, "You lie!" and then starts playing with his Blackberry. Other opposing board members also boo, laugh derisively, and check e-mail, and one even walks out early.

At the same time, disgruntled employees (all of whom own company stock, but none of whom are board members) are picketing outside with signs saying, "CEO Obama is a lying liar."

Surely we can all see that there is a significant difference between the acceptable levels of speech in the boardroom and on the street? Surely we can see that there is something profoundly unacceptable and counterproductive about the board members' behavior? The President was addressing Congress on a matter of national business. It behooves Congress to behave appropriately and do business, not to mug for the cameras and flirt with their most supportive constituents.

The question is not whether Wilson has the right to insult Obama--obviously he does. He has plenty of platforms to do it, and plenty of opportunities to object to the health care plan both in the eyes of his constituents and (in a more substantive way) in the presence of his colleagues. But he does not have the right to shout Obama down while Obama is taking his turn to speak, particularly when the authority to speak has been granted him by the same chamber that gives Wilson public standing in the first place.

Change the Subject

By: roscoeluca | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 14:00

"I will not waste time with those who have made the calculation that it's better politics to kill this plan than to improve it." -Barack Obama

Republicans would love for the nation to discuss heckling rather than health care.

Let's stay on point in our conversations with friends and family everyone. Better security and lower costs for people with health insurance from their employers. Quality, affordable insurance for the rest of us. Commitment to Medicare. No deficit spending. No tax hikes for people who make less than $250k.

What's So Bad About Calling the President a Liar?

By: OohRah Mama | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 13:43

Let's not forget another obvious reason Wilson shouldn't have called Obama a liar: The President WASN'T LYING.

Thankfully, I've NEVER said anything inappropriate!

By: nashvillekvetch | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 13:12

I think we can let it go. The guy knows he screwed up, he apologized and the damage is done. Do we really need to run it into the ground?

Here's what I think. I would much rather have listened to his quick, impassioned outburst than watched his colleagues play with their Blackberries, hold up sheafs of paper and roll their eyes. Give me aggressive over passive-aggressive any day.

While part of me would love to engage in the schadenfreude and beat the guy down, I actually appreciate that while his timing was shitty, and while I don't agree with what he said - hell, at least he believes in something strongly enough to have an opinion on it.

So I'm going to let it go, and hope that if (or let's be honest, WHEN) I commit a verbal faux pas, people won't hold an interminable grudge.

missing the point

By: reluctant_soprano | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 12:53

The issue is not whether or not it's appropriate to call the President a liar at any time. The problem with Wilson's action was that it happened during the President's time to talk to the public. The opposing side was given the opportunity to respond in a civil manner after Obama finished speaking. The only thing such blatant disregard for order can do for Wilson's opinions (however unfounded - read any of a number of links to the text stating that illegal immigrants are NOT covered under the proposal) is to link them to the same kind of petty grade-school tactics that have been used recently to stifle intelligent debate about health care reform. Yes, someone threw a shoe at Bush. But if it had been one of our elected representatives, the reaction would have been entirely different. For members of Congress to grumble at a speech is normal. For one to act in a way that isn't allowed in the classroom by elementary school teachers is appalling.

This is hard for me

By: Tricia | Thu, 09/10/2009 - 12:41

I'm not standing up and cheering for Joe Wilson like Hanna is, but I have to admit that there were times I was just crying for someone with some power to shout something similar at President George W. Bush when he stood at podiums around the country and in front of Congress and, well, lied.

When you believe that someone is abusing the office the way I believe W did, it's not admirable to "respect the office" and let the lying and abuse continue.

I don't agree at all with Joe Wilson. I don't think health care for immigrants rises to the same level of outrage that a fabricated war does. But I'd be hypocritical not to recognize the relief and admiration that his supporters probably feel right now. They think they're speaking truth to power.