Hate-Watching the Ugly Truth

@p.bateman

By: Caerolle | Fri, 07/31/2009 - 09:37

Well, i was talking about 'gang bang' meaning 'gang rape' to me AS A TERM, not necessarily the act itself, and meant to say (if I didnt) that if 'gang bang' means a single person having sex with multiple partners at the same time, and that person wants to do it, it isnt rape, whether it is one girl and a bunch of guys, one girl and a bunch of girls, one guy and a bunch of girls, or one guy and a bunch of guys. If the person getting 'banged' is *not* consenting (and I would add eager), if it is being done against their will, then yes, it *is* rape to me, and prolly an extremely terrifying one.
Does that help, or do you have some other point you are trying to make?

caerolle

By: p.bateman | Fri, 07/31/2009 - 05:45

i wanna ask you somethign
is it also a gang-bang when a guy has sex with multiple females?

wanna know your personal opinion... is the guy a victim in that case?

@p.bateman

By: Caerolle | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 17:54

I have no argument with any parties involved in any kind of consenting-adult encounter. In fact, I know a girl who loves be be with several guys at once, and that is her business, though it makes me wince, and I worry about her.
My formative experiences with the phrase 'gang-bang' *were* gang rape, which has always stuck with me. The context always seemed to be to humiliate and degrade the victim, so fairly or unfairly, I have very strong feelings about 'gang-bang.'
What I dont understand is why you are so defensive about the whole thing? I would be interested to hear your perspective.

@ Caerolle

By: p.bateman | Fri, 07/31/2009 - 05:41

it doesnt matter how you feel about the gang bang thing. you can be disgusted at it, you can like it, you can dislike it.

but when women dont like a certain sexual phenomenon, they talk about it demonizing the men involved in it. they cannot be impartial. they cannot be objective and dont try to fool me that you are. im sure that when youre talking about the phenomenon of gang-bang with your feminist ilk you are more often asking questions "why do men have to degrade women like that".....you ask this question much more often than "why do women allow themselves to be degraded like that"

if you think its DEGRADING....go ahead and think is your right to think about it that way. just like the feminists who think porn, stripping is degrading women. but hold both parties equally responsible for the degradation. you take responsibility away from women of things that you personally dont like. for eg i never hear a feministe saying "why do girls have to flash their tits on GIRLS GONE WILD" but always spewing hatred over guys who love to watch it, and those who film it.

similarly when degrading and sleazy sex acts occur in frat parties and feminists are uncomfortable about it, they fcuking blame the ones who let the parties happen (authorities), the frat boys who indulge in them, but they never fucking hold the girls responsible for those sex acts. they never question why do the girls show up on frat parties and let 5 drunk guys run a train on her. AFTERALL ITS HER FUCKING CHOICE....ITS HER BODY !!!! right ma'am?

feminists will never criticize women for sexual aspects they are themselves uncomfortable with and find misogynist, degrading, sleazy, objectifying etc. because if they do so, they will be seen as suppressing womens sexuality!

@Foobs

By: Caerolle | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 13:17

You are right of course! The term I have heard is 'hate fuck' not 'hate rape.' I guess I so strongly identify the phrase 'hate fuck' with rape (whether ppl who use that term mean it that way or not), that what I understand when I see 'hate fuck' *is* rape, and that just extends to everything else that uses that construction. Also, the adjective 'hate' in these phrases screams 'exercise of power against someone to keep or put them in their place' which is horribly abusive (tho I guess a movie doesn't much care, would only apply to those involved with making it, if the hate watch were performed to impact them). Thanks for correcting me.
`
I still *really* hate the phrase 'hate fuck,' and 'hate watch' tho, and I doubt that will ever change. Kind of like 'gang-banger' still means a participant in a mass rape to me, rather than a member of a gang. I guess I am just too rigid to get with the times on some things.
`
Sorry for the misguided rant.
`
Carol

Caerolle

By: Foobs | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 12:57

I have never heard (apart from your use), the term "hate rape". I have heard to term "hate sex" and "hate fuck" (the first, I think, being the noun form and the second being the verb form).

Enjoying rom-coms for what they are

By: Liz W | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 12:26

Why do I go to see romantic comedies? Maybe because there’s something reassuring about seeing an alternate universe where life and dating follow consistent patterns and rules. Romantic comedies impose a linear progression on what in the real world can be difficult and confusing. The idea that the process could be so easy is reassuring – and my relief at the end that the whole tidy storybook package is *not* real is also reassuring. I'm looking for a true partner I can grow with, not an instant happy ending - I prefer my own messy life when the movie’s over, every time. But romantic comedies are an oxymoronic blend of reassuringly appealing story arc plus reassuringly unappealing denouement. I think I could do a lot worse for escapism.

'hate watch'

By: Caerolle | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 11:44

I like rom-coms as a genre, but a huge number of them are mean-spirited (esp toward women) like this one, and I pretty much despise those.
`
However, the bigger comment I want to make is about the term 'hate watch.' Perhaps I am being oversensitive, but seeing that was a shock. That phrase took me striaght to 'hate rape,' which I find disgusting (both the phrase and the act). I get the idea of watching these movies while being totally disgusted by them, analagous to having sex with someone you despise just be even more disgusted by them and perhaps to punish yourself (tho I really feel the punishment is more intended for the person being 'raped').
`
Personally, tho, I cant separate the word 'rape' from 'hate rape' (it also sounds a lot like 'date rape'); for me any deriviative of a terrible phrase or act delivers the original horrid feeling to the new application ('Soup Nazi'). I just wish the use of this type of phrase would not be spread and expanded to new uses, esp on a female-oriented site.
`
Carol

Why do women watch this crap?

By: Kozmic Blues | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 11:05

I don't really know. But I don't watch them unless forced, so I can't really answer for myself. But I suspect that part of it is that nearly every other genre is geared towards men and therefore full of explosions, boobs, and 'bromances'. We're 'supposed' to like these movies. Though, if given the choice, I'll take explosions, boobs, and bromances over the typical, self-loathing, emotional porn that is the typical rom-com. The movies usually suck equally, but at least those movies are open and honest about being insulting to the women (when there are relevant women at all) in them instead of the weird mind altering messages wrapped in the false promise of eternal happiness and never ending joy.

"are there other reasonable explanations why women watch this?"

By: p.bateman | Tue, 07/28/2009 - 05:44

sure, but they may be politically incorrect!

how about the explanation that women on average may really be more relationship/romance oriented than men.